As you design and develop learning experiences, AI can be a powerful ally. In this episode, Jenessa Jacobs, director of training at Second Avenue offers ways you can use artificial intelligence.
AI enthusiast Jenessa Jacobs shared these insights about leveraging artificial intelligence to improve your L&D work.
Powered by Learning earned an Award of Distinction in the Podcast/Audio category from The Communicator Awards and a Silver Davey Award for Educational Podcast. The podcast is also named to Feedspot's Top 40 L&D podcasts and Training Industry’s Ultimate L&D Podcast Guide.
Learn more about d'Vinci at www.dvinci.com.
Powered by Learning - Episode 63
Susan Cort: [00:00:00] You know you should use artificial intelligence on your L& D team, but how do you get started?
Jenessa Jacobs: I think of the AI as another human in the room. If I need someone to bounce ideas off of, if I need someone to discuss with, if I need someone to say, hey, this is what I've put together, help me identify x, y, z. I use the AI as if it was another all-knowing person.
Susan Cort: That's Jenessa Jacobs, Director of Training at Second Avenue. She'll offer practical ways that you can use AI in your everyday work to make you and your team more efficient and productive. Next, on Powered by Learning.
Announcer: Powered by Learning is brought to you by d'Vinci Interactive. d'Vinci's approach to learning is grounded in 30 years of innovation and expertise. We use proven strategies and leading technology to develop solutions that empower learners to improve quality [00:01:00] and boost performance. Learn more at dvinci.com.
Susan Cort: Joining me today is d’Vinci Client Solutions Consultant, Angeline Evans, and our guest, Jenessa Jacobs, Director of Training at Second Avenue. Great to see you again, Jenessa.
Angeline Evans: Hi, Jenessa.
Jenessa Jacobs: Hey, everyone. Thanks so much for having me today.
Susan Cort: Well, we're so glad you could join us. Let, let's start off by telling our listeners a little bit about your background and also your role at Second Avenue.
Jenessa Jacobs: Absolutely. So I am a certified professional in training management. Um, I currently work as the director of training at Second Avenue, which is a single-family real estate property management company. And what I'm doing here is I am standing up their learning and development department. Prior to that, I did the same thing for Pinnacle Home Care. I've worked for Coca Cola and a few other health, uh, and home health companies.
Susan Cort: Well, that's great. Well, we're excited to learn more about your journey, uh, in your current role and also how you're using artificial intelligence.We can all learn from each other there. [00:02:00] Yeah, absolutely.
Angeline Evans: So you have a book coming out, How to Apply AI to your ADDIE Model. Can you tell us more about that?
Jenessa Jacobs: For sure. So the book is scheduled to come out this December. I'm very excited for it. And what it does is it takes the very popular ADDIE Model and it applies AI to it. And one of the things that you'll hear me say if you've, uh, listened to me on a webinar discussing AI is save your brain power. Save your brain power for the important things and let AI do the heavy lifting. It goes over a lot of things through the ADDIE model, like how do you apply AI to analysis, how do you apply it to design, development, how can you apply it even to the end of the process, uh, with your evaluations and turning around that ROI very quickly.
Angeline Evans: That is so cool. I'm really excited to read it when it comes out in December.
Susan Cort: Yeah, we'll, we'll, we'll put it in the show notes too so people can find it easily.
Angeline Evans: You know, I'm really interested if we could dive deeper into each component of the ADDIE model. Um, I, [00:03:00] I love your note about how it helps you save brain power because that's so true. Sometimes you just get stuck in a creative rut with a sentence or something or really hung up on one piece and it slows you down along the process. So could you share like a case study example or anything that could help us walk through and, and envision this?
Jenessa Jacobs: For sure, for sure. So I use this in my process. And I know that ADDIE is not a model that is commonly used just because SAM is much quicker and there's even Agile methods that allow for more flexibility, especially as quick as everything changes. So, what the book's designed to do is talk about If you are doing any portion of the ADDIE model that falls under either SAM or Agile methods, you can still apply AI to it. So, for example, in my business, we work more in a SAM model, more of a successive, you know, approximation. Um, and then we decompress and we move from [00:04:00] there. Um, when we do that process of that decompressing, that re clarifying, that getting approximately close to it, and then the process we call cleaning it, we utilize AI a lot for the analysis of that.
Jenessa Jacobs: So that's things like identifying gaps, looking at what we call the three P's, the people, the process or the product and identifying where the gaps are within that by throwing it through things like even ChatGPT. So when I put my analysis process into ChatGPT, I ask it to do an audience analysis. I ask it to do a context analysis.
Jenessa Jacobs: I ask it to do things like a performance analysis. I ask it to do things like a stakeholder analysis based on previous things people have done that it can pull from, you know, even a constraint analysis, there may be things and challenges that I didn't think to think of that then I can include in a project plan to get [00:05:00] closer to our finished product.
Jenessa Jacobs: Additionally, too, in our surveys, it's such a huge help with our surveys because I don't have to think about questions to ask. I can also then, ask the AI to generate my questions in a language in which my audience can understand. So, I'm making sure to, uh, get a little bit more input, if you will, through that. Um, I can also ask it to even test my surveys for me, or test my project scope and look for holes and gaps and things that I may not have thought of. So, that's one of the ways that I apply it to my analysis. Um, when we talk about the design, it's the same thing. It's helping me to find gaps, it's helping save my brain power, coming up with, you know, what's the best way to do this.
Jenessa Jacobs: When I go through my design process, I run by the rule of, if it's information that does not change, it's basic information, and that basic [00:06:00] information for me is usually eLearning, so I design out my process through things like ChatGPT, saying, hey, design an eLearning for me that consists of this basic information.
Jenessa Jacobs: Obviously being very mindful of any proprietary information, being very mindful of anything that's sensitive information. I tend to use, the training industry actually has a great model in there that's the content, and that helps me determine whether or not it's safe to put it into the AI.
Angeline Evans: Wonderful. So, for folks that might be listening that are brand new to ChatGPT and AI in general, when you say you're using it in the analysis and the design phase, are you inputting notes? Are you inputting feedback gathered? Can you be more specific about the types of things you're entering to get feedback? The results you need from the tools.
Jenessa Jacobs: For sure. I think of the AI as another human in the room. And what I mean by that is if I need someone to bounce [00:07:00] ideas off of, if I need someone to discuss with, if I need someone to say, Hey, this is what I've put together. Help me identify X, Y, Z, whether that's gaps, whether that's how to design this into a scenario, how to create a script for it, how to, uh, give me a well thought out project scope. I use the AI as if it was another all-knowing person in that sense. So, I have a discussion with it and then based on what I put in, whether that be questions, whether that be, hey, read my text and help me summarize, understand, or change the language.
Jenessa Jacobs: I then ask follow up questions. And I adjust and I, I ask the AI to adjust its process as well so that we get closer to the model and what I'm looking for.
Susan Cort: So you're saving the brainpower that way.
Jenessa Jacobs: I'm saving the brainpower. I have two of me being able to do this. [00:08:00]
Angeline Evans: I do like how you mentioned you ask questions. I do the same thing. I use it as like an independent brainstorming partner. As if there is a real person on the other end. I don't know why I'm so conversational with ChatGPT.
Susan Cort: I'm sure it appreciates it.
Angeline Evans: Um, but it certainly helps. So that's, I mean, that's, that's wonderful the way you're using it. Have you, what has your experience been with your colleagues and learners when they see how much you've integrated AI into the process?
Jenessa Jacobs: Obviously, there's a lot of awe and a lot of wonder because AI is so new to us and there's a lot that we don't understand with AI.There's a lot I don't understand with AI, but I gotta tell you, I love using it. But there's a lot of awe, there's a lot of wonder, there's a lot of excitement, and there's a lot of re- engagement that happens back into the training and back into being a part of the process because of this.
Susan Cort: I bet a lot of, a lot of people are in awe in part because they haven't [00:09:00] Thank you have. Do you think a little bit of it is just that, that fear of the unknown, not knowing how to get started? I mean, do you, do you think that that's at all some of the apprehension?
Jenessa Jacobs: Absolutely. Absolutely. And I mean, and this is what a great, uh. What a great topic to bring up because whenever I look at identifying in training, you know, why, why are we training on this?
Jenessa Jacobs: It usually comes down to two things. It's either confidence or competent, you know, so the confidence to be able to do it or the competent to be able to do it. So if they're not confident in utilizing it, they're not going to utilize it. If they're not competent in utilizing it, they may be utilizing it, but they're not doing it correctly in there.
Jenessa Jacobs: I think you're correct in the sense that getting into something that is unknown can be very scary for some. But developing that confidence, developing that competence then, is a big step in the process.
Angeline Evans: So, tell me more about the development, implementation, and [00:10:00] evaluation phases.
Jenessa Jacobs: Absolutely. So, the development phase is one of my absolute favorites when it comes to utilizing AI and utilizing things like chat GPT.
Jenessa Jacobs: Um, so like I said before, a lot of my basic information usually goes into e learning because there's not a lot of variables, but once we start getting into that intermediate or advanced level. I usually like to have ChatGPT help me to create things like PowerPoints, help me create role plays, help me create scenarios, help me think of variables that might happen within this process that we could then prepare our learners for.
Jenessa Jacobs: So, as we begin to develop those, we can have AI create scripts, we can have AI create variables, we can have AI even be a part of our training process in a conversation practice.
Angeline Evans: And for PowerPoints, are you finding it helpful in creating your screen text, or even going as far as to creating some facilitator scripting points?
Jenessa Jacobs: Absolutely both. Yep. [00:11:00] Um, a lot of times when I get into that development phase, I'll say, hey, you know, here are my objectives that I need to train on. Please design a PowerPoint that will meet these objectives, and then we go through and refine. Once I get that to the way. I like it. I'll then ask the AI, Hey, please generate a facilitator script that matches the PowerPoint.
Susan Cort: Jenessa, you mentioned ChatGPT, but for people listening who are thinking, well, AI, that sounds great, but that's so broad. Like, can you suggest other tools that you've used to really implement this into your workflow each day?
Jenessa Jacobs: For sure. So there's a lot that is like ChatGPT, such as Google Labs. There's a lot of, uh, other AI that's out there that generates, uh, images. Google has a, has a beta right now that they're working on for that. I believe Pixlr also is able to generate images, so I can generate images to match the text that's on my PowerPoint and create an image that is specific to what I want the learner to know. Additionally, I utilize Murph a [00:12:00] lot for voice generation. So it's not my voice that I'm recording on the eLearnings. That way, if it ever needs to be updated, maintained, changed, I can put it back into Murph and have the AI generate the voice for me. And it sounds like a human voice instead of that text to speech that comes with a lot of authoring programs. So I can use AI not only for the text for the pictures, for the voice, hitting all different types of learners.
Susan Cort: So really from start to finish.
Jenessa Jacobs: Start to finish. Saving that brain power.
Angeline Evans: For the evaluation step, you know, um, we all host our eLearning and different programs and a learning management system that often has that. Always has that reporting capability, right?So that's the whole point. You're getting that transcript data from the learner. What do you, how do you use AI to help interpret that?
Jenessa Jacobs: So I like to utilize the Kirkpatrick model. Um, and the Kirkpatrick model goes over the four different levels of evaluation, if you will. So level one, the reaction, level two, the learning, level three, the [00:13:00] behavior and level four, the results in there.
Jenessa Jacobs: So when we talk about level one, the reaction is we're evaluating that. You know, I'm looking for, did participants find the training favorable, engaging, and relevant to their jobs? And oftentimes, that's a survey to my participants. And I can utilize that AI to create those survey questions based on what was trained on.
Jenessa Jacobs: I can also use that AI to say, hey, you know, here were the variables that happened during this training. Should I ask other questions on that? So then level two is the learning side of that. And a lot of times, level 2 and level 3 are hard to distinguish between how do I evaluate that. So, level 2 in learning, which is the degree to which the participants acquired the attended knowledge, you know, so, in other words, the knowledge, the skills, the attitude, the confidence, the, the commitment, based on their participation in this training, a lot of times what I have what I use to evaluate that is, can they repeat it back to me?
Jenessa Jacobs: Is there some way in which they [00:14:00] can articulate that they know it? You know, um, so I'll throw that into ChatGPT, I'll throw that into Google Labs, and I'll say, Hey, uh, help me find a way to evaluate a, their learning. And be able to articulate what they may have learned based on these objectives here. And then level three is the behavior.
Jenessa Jacobs: So what I look at for the behavior is usually running reports such as the steps recorder that's found in Windows to identify how long the process originally took versus how long it's taking now. And taking that data, throwing it into the AI and say, giving me a summary of results, you know, what may we have missed in this training that we can do for the next one there?
Jenessa Jacobs: Or even, how can I present these results to, uh, my stakeholders? Give me a PowerPoint that's going to talk about the Kirkpatrick model and talk about how I evaluated this training. And then of course the results there, [00:15:00] um, you know, which are the targeted outcomes that we had, the objectives there. How can I, I even will put this into the AI, how can I measure these objectives?
Jenessa Jacobs: What are some of the ways other people have done it? So again, using that AI like another human or a thought partner and through that evaluation method.
Angeline Evans: That truly is end to end right there.
Susan Cort: That's for sure.
Angeline Evans: Through the ADDIE model, that's, uh, that's awesome. And those were some really great examples for our listeners.
Angeline Evans: We did, we did talk how, you know, it's all about your confidence and competence with using AI. And I love those two words together, because it's so true when you're doing learning and development, it's your confidence in your competence and a new skill. What lessons have you learned along the way?You know, AI is constantly evolving. What sort of, just share more about your lessons and ways that we might be able to save ourselves from the same mistakes as we're taking this journey.
Jenessa Jacobs: Absolutely. So everyone's experience is different. Let's preface it with that one. [00:16:00] And for me, I was definitely in a space where I was overworked. Right? So overworked and that, but a lot of times I'm copying and pasting over and my proofreading was not there. So make sure you proofread. You absolutely have to proofread. You absolutely need to understand your social and cultural, even constraints and limitations and your audience prior to putting anything into your training because AI is so sophisticated now that your learners may not be at that level. So make sure that you meet them where they're at. And the more specific you are with the AI, the more specific. It can be to help you get where you need to be. So proofread, proofread, proofread. Also, ask the AI to cite its sources. That's a big one.
Angeline Evans: That's a good one.
Jenessa Jacobs: That is a good one. It's a great point. For sure. Don't get yourself in trouble with any kind of copyright laws. Don't get yourself in trouble with anything that is someone else's intellectual [00:17:00] property that they may have posted on the internet as a preview or a freebie or whatever the case might be, that the AI may have picked up.
Susan Cort: Or AI hallucinations, too.
Jenessa Jacobs: Exactly that. Exactly that. So, make sure you ask the AI to cite its sources from the information that it gives you. So, two really good tidbits.
Angeline Evans: Those are very good tidbits. When the AI cites the sources, do you go out and personally vet them, or are you asking AI to double check the citing to see if there's any restrictions?
Jenessa Jacobs: There's a little bit of both. Yeah. There's definitely a little bit of both. If it doesn't give me a good cite for its sources, there's a lot of times that I'll take what the AI has given me, especially if it's ChatGPT, and I'll throw it into Google and see what Google gives me to see if it came from specific sources specific website, see if it came from books, texts, pdf gov sites, whatever the case may be, just so that I can understand where the AI is getting the information. So there's a lot of times I'll take what [00:18:00] the AI gave me, pieces, bits of it, all of it, throw it into Google, just to better understand, you know, hey, Is it citing correctly?
Jenessa Jacobs: Is it hallucinating the sightings, you know? Um, or, you know, is there additional work and research that I need to do there to back up the claims that I'm seeing? Or is this even protected information that you need to technically pay for in order to utilize it in the context that you want to utilize it for?
Susan Cort: Janessa, just thinking of more advice for people getting started, do you think it's best to look for where there's a potential use case and then go for it? Find an AI solution or find an AI solution and kind of, uh, think about ways in which it might help you with your work.
Jenessa Jacobs: That is a great question. I think that's a chicken and the egg kind of question, if you will, which they did say that chickens came first I'll have you know, um, that it has been AI. That's your first task. Go ask the AI and it'll tell you all about it. [00:19:00] Anyways, you know, you can do both. Um, it, I think it would depend on your workload. I think it would depend on how much, you know, time you've got on your plate. I think it would depend on, you know, what your comfort level is with AI.
Jenessa Jacobs: I mean, always... Always, always connect back anything that you're doing to the organizational business goals and making sure that you are protecting your brainpower, your work life balance. Um, if there are pain points in your ADDIE model, in your SAM model, in your Agile model, find ways in which you may be able to utilize AI to mitigate some of those pain points.
Susan Cort: And just circling back to your book for a moment, what are you hoping that people get out of the book? Just to kind of wrap things up with us today, when people are finished, what, what do you think the takeaways might be?
Jenessa Jacobs: I'm really hoping that they get a really good work life balance. It's super important to me that they're able to build confidence and competence and utilizing this AI, and they're able to take this information [00:20:00] And use the AI, um, to its fullest potential and their fullest potential and really empower them to be able to do more to help others.
So I'm hoping that they're able to take this book, read the information, better understand AI, feel more confident with it, um, and just... Be able to help because learning and development departments are running super lean nowadays more than ever. And people are recognizing the need for more training and more learning.
Jenessa Jacobs: Uh, so they're being asked to do more than they ever have been before. So hopefully this will help save their brain power and keep them in the learning and development field for longer.
Susan Cort: Oh, that's terrific. Well, thank you for helping us to save our brain power today. You gave some terrific responses and I think you're empowering people listening to go out and learn more about artificial intelligence and, and figure out the best ways that they can put it to work for them and their jobs. So, Jenessa Jacobs, thank you for joining us today. Thank you so much for having me. [00:21:00]
Angeline Evans: Thank you so much. It was really helpful to hear you walk through the ADDIE model with AI. I loved it.
Susan Cort Thanks. Bye bye.
Jenessa Jacobs: Bye now.
Susan Cort: Angeline, Jenessa is really putting AI to the test. And she had some great practical uses.
Angeline Evans: She did. I really enjoyed talking to her and hearing all of the ways she's using AI in her role. You know, we talked about this when we were at TICE this year, but AI as a topic was the main event, and I know we've even done some podcasts on AI, right?
Angeline Evans: So the halls are always buzzing about the AI sessions, but at the same time, the majority of attendees we spoke to felt nervous about using it and they weren't really sure how to start.
Susan Cort: I think that's the key is just it's a great resource to start with but once you do put your toe in the water and start experimenting and listening to people like Jenessa sharing some ways that they're using it all of a sudden it doesn't become scary at all. It becomes a really great tool.
Angeline Evans: Yes, it was even the case at d’Vinci, right? You know, our team was so excited to start integrating AI as soon as new technologies [00:22:00] started coming out how can we put it into our workflow? But there was still hesitancy at first and it took us a bit to establish our point of view and our use policy.
Angeline Evans: Especially now with, with d'Vinci being a vendor, we need to ensure we're always setting expectations up front. We're maintaining transparency into our process and above all, always protecting client confidentiality. So for our listeners out there who maybe haven't dipped their toe fully into the water with AI, I say, give it a go.Um, you know, as Jenessa said, save your brainpower and see if you can leverage it to make your time more well spent. Uh, just be sure to also consider any standard operating procedure when it comes to using AI for your work.
Susan Cort: No, good advice. I even know with Powered by Learning, I wasn't using AI before and at first I was a little hesitant because I already had a really good process in place, but now that I'm using AI to help with, uh, processing and editing the podcast. It's been a great tool and I'm really thankful for the new process and the time back in my day to do other things.
Angeline Evans: Yes. It's incredible how it's been able to streamline that.
Susan Cort: Thanks, Angeline. And [00:23:00] special thanks to our guest, Jenessa Jacobs of Second Avenue for sharing her expertise with us. If you have an idea for a topic or a guest, please reach out to us at firstname.lastname@example.org. And don't forget to subscribe to Powered by Learning wherever you listen to your podcasts.